The night we broke into Dan Kimball's church
Long before we ever suspected we would be planting a church in the Bay area, Janet and I had a rather unique experience with our friends Rusty and Stephanie, and Daniel and Rhonda. We burglarized Dan Kimball’s church.
Well…it wasn’t exactly a burglary; more like an unguided tour that took place a couple months ago when I was visiting Santa Cruz. Several friends, one of whom works with the Vintage Faith congregation offered to drive us to the building to take a look at their new facility.
We arrived at a brick structure that, too all appearances, was a standard-brand California Presbyterian church. But one of my friends explained that Vintage Faith has developed a relationship with their hosts in which they share the same building, and lots of other stuff, in a two-year experiment in church hybridity.
We just happened to visit Vintage Faith as a wedding rehearsal was underway, resulting in lots of open doors all over the facility. So we started walking through them, investigating the lovely, classic sanctuary, walking the corridors, standing in the gym, and checking out Dan’s new office (through the window).
So I guess in that sense it was sort of a break in. We were uninvited. I think the people at the wedding rehearsal may have assumed we were caterers or something. But lots of church site visits have taught me that the best discoveries often happen using the burglary model: just show up and see what happens.
What impressed me about Dan’s set-up was the hybrid model: two congregations, both contributing their gifts in an integrated way. The Presbyterians have a great tradition, location and facility, and Vintage Faith has vision, energy, and young people. It’s not exactly a merger, but it’s not exactly a host-and-guest situation either.
Other sectors of our culture seem to sense the potential of hybrid models. Check out Fast Company’s slideshow on the future of hybrid vehicles, for example. Maybe church leaders need to think about how to combine the gifts of their organization with those of another organization. After all, that’s exactly what we ask individuals to do when we bring them together to form congregations.
For Discussion:
1. Is Dan’s situation unique, or does hybridity really offer a path forward for lots of churches?
2. Has anyone seen other hybrid models out there that we can learn from?
[This blog originally appeared on Monday Morning Insight
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I have been watching this type of kingdom focused partnership happen in Fresno California with The Well Church and Cross Church. I think it started off to be a host guest situation but has been turing into, “How can we partner to make the biggest impact?”
The Well’s Hed pastor is Brad Bell, web page: www.thewellcommunity.com
I think Dan knows as well as anyone how this sort of thing can work really well or can crash and burn – it all depends on the level of understanding and generous orthodoxy from the outset.
I know too from personal experience that this sort of thing can end very very badly. I hope someday I can experience the side of it that can work well.
Not wanting to be the wet blanket – and also not really knowing enough about the model to really say anything cogent about it…mnnn…I think it’s questionable.
But I’m a dyed-in-the-wool denominational fuddy-duddy from the Lutheran church. We’re into speaking with one voice about what we believe.
I think if the Presbyterian church is willing to share space and such, that’s very commendable. I think the line still needs to be drawn on the side of “we believe this,” “we don’t believe that.”
Additionally, I think it is the responsibility and calling of ANY church to help out any other church that needs help in matters of space and the like. I’m a little confused as to why Vintage is doing this, though. But I’m open to explanation. The long and short of it is, I’m not down with making things look the same if they are not the same. I am down with helping a brotha out.
jWinters – are you Missouri Synod?
Ari – I am. Sorry about the late response. Lots on my plate these days. Oh…and I should mention – I’m not quite the “typical” LC-MS guy, so I’m more than willing to talk about where you think I might be right on or way off without condemning you to hell. :-) God’s richest blessings on your day! – jW
oh no, not at all. I was just going to say that most Lutherans I know would be very “into” doing what Vintage Faith’s Presbyterian church is doing – but the only Lutherans I know are ELCA ;) Which is why I guessed you were Missouri Synod but I didn’t want to assume.
I’m not sure how vast Kimball’s relationship is with that church but my impression is more than it’s a “restricted” collaboration that only extends as far as each groups theology allows.
there is a presbyterian church in my area that has an emergent service that would totally do that – and then there’s a big one in my town that would never consider it but they DO work with young life extensively.
I think collaborations can work very well across denominational lines as long as there’s an understanding from the beginning about how vast the collaboration is going to be.
we’ve experienced the good and the bad as has Kimball – although he admittedly more so.
hah!...well, now you can say you know of an LC-MS Lutheran if you ever need to know something about us.
A particular collaboration I was thinking of was a Lutheran church (Mo. Synod) that provided space for a Vineyard church plant. Lines were drawn showing the differences between the two, but I think both of the pastors (I knew the Lutheran pastor) grew because of the natural conversations that would pop up.
I think THAT is the big thing for churches to do. I may not agree all the time with the church down the street, but I can always learn something from what they’re doing and thinking.
In Christ, jW
My dad’s family is Missouri Synod but that’s my only exposure – so now I know ;)
I agree, that is a HUGE thing for churches to do. It’s a bold step and makes a wonderful statement to the sought. They will know we are Christians by our love right?
and I also agree that it’s a great “growth step” in the arena of cross denominational dialog.
The one that I’ve seen work is New Life Church in the Chicago area. Its not a perfect example, but here’s what happened. .. An older congregation with lots of money, but no younger people, or clue of what to reach them heard of a pastor named Mark Jobe. Jobe’s church was reaching lots of young people. So the elder board of the elder church approached him about a merger. Long story short, there’s now a young vibrant church in an old traditional building in one of the artsy areas of Chicago. Here’s their website http://www.newlifechicago.org/home.cfm
Is hybridity a real word? My church community is just a few blocks from PresbyVin Faith. Nothing on the outside expresses that it is any different from the traditional Presbyterian Church, but people seem to be continually attracted to VF. Maybe relational connections are
the biggest marketing tool for the church and not visibility and advertising.
We have space issues at our church and were considering doing something like that with some of the churches in our community to help us with our space issues and possibly lend them some potentially cool programming.
I think logistically it’s ridiculous for church not to share space when they’re in the same neighborhood especially. One way, IMO, that churches can collaborate is for liturgical traditions to allow non liturgical traditions use of their fellowship halls. The cool thing about non lit and lit. traditions collaborating is that there is less “competition”. The non lit. traditions can meet on a sunday evening or saturday or weekday and then the communities can work together in areas of commonality.
Maybe it’s a pipe dream but I have those dreams a lot.
You say you’re emerging to become culturally relevant, but eventually culture, like it always has and always will, will change and leave you in the dust of what you thought was emerging.
You’ll never do any good trying to stick with the shifting sand of society.
Stick with God’s word, which is unchanging and never in harmony with the majority.
The church I attend and teach at, Emmanuel Christian Center in Minnesota, is a hybrid church. We have a Spanish congregation that runs separate, yet intertwined with the historic anglo-saxon/african part of our congregation. Both congregations utilize so much of the building resources that we find ourselves a community of people that are different, yet the same, working together. Both churches cater to the elements of the other and offer translation services for cross cultural interaction. The Pastoral staff of each is under the same bylaws and financial structure.